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few housekeeping items: Still Responsible to God, What’s the Point?, God Did Just Fine Without Us, Will My Life Have Been More Significant Than an Animals?, Falling Short of God’s Glory, Man a Poor Steward of the Plant, Evidence for Resurrection, Unintended Kool-Aid Drinking, Scary Religious Talk, Wild Asses of Islam, Jesus’ Coming Theocracy, Trusting Superstition...
Response to comment: “…We as human beings didn't ask to come here…[W]e didn't apply for the job of being human beings. We didn’t ask to be born.”
True, we did not ask to be born. But the fact remains—we are here. We’d better deal with it.
Response to comment: “What's the point?"
The point is to know and honor our creator.
Response to comment: “Much of life is full of misery and lacking in purpose, so why would a [G]od bring us here, especially if there's a "perfect heaven" already in existence for us to go to. [G]od was lonely [a theist said].”
The trinity had a perfect union and fellowship before we arrived on the scene. Perhaps in all of God’s creativity, he wanted to create something wonderful and even in his own image.
Response to comment: “It's sorta like me being a parent. I along with my wife brought two children into this world. They didn't ask to come. So that makes us responsible for raising them. They don't owe us anything. The really don't even have to obey us, because they didn't ask to come here. Well, though that analogy could be extended to the concept of God, it's really not the same thing. What we did as parents was merely a part of procreation, something that nearly all living organisms participate in.”
God is not man. Children are responsible to parents (Eph 6:1) although we seem to have it backwards today. The bad news is that we are here and we have a problem—sin. The good news is that the remedy to our problem is Jesus.
Response to comment: “There's no reason "God" would needs us here.”
I do not know that God needed us but he did create us. We are therefore responsible to him. God being God certainly had a purpose in mind for us.
Response to comment: “There's no real natural purpose for us being here.”
Hopefully we will add more meaning to our lives than mere animals (Eccl 3:21).
Response to comment: “The only meaning to life is what we give it and…strive toward.”
Hopefully you see that our holiness falls far short from God’s holiness (Ro 3:23). We were made for eternity. The Christian has hope but the unsaved pagan heathen has no hope. What matters in this life is whether or not we choose to trust in the Lord.
Response to comment: “[T]he meaning for life is constantly developing and changing as we grow and honestly try to make this world a better place. And now that we're clearly living in an age of modernity, notions of a god, heaven and hell, are simply outdated and insufficient for our needs in a modern world.”
Man has never had much success making the world a better place.
Response to Comment:
“SeperentDove, ...What you write is taken straight out of old biblical mythology and theology. Your arguments are lacking in evidence and just pure common sense. In each of your stated responses, you simply speak for God because your fictional God can't speak for himself. How can a character in a book jump out of the pages and start talking.
…[T]he designs of your fictional God certainly went awry. If we are indeed a product of his creation, then we only have him to blame for what he is created. But again, we are talking about a fictional character, not a real being. You're old tired platitudes of what God said and intends for us simply don't make for good arguments.
Atheists are people who don't drink the Kool-Aid. ...”
Do you believe the news on the radio or in the newspaper each day? Do you believe history books? Why is it so hard to believe the bible? The bible does not lack evidence. In fact, evidence suggests that: Jesus existed, he was who he claimed to be, deception is unlikely, his resurrection is supported by witnesses, his resurrection was a historical event, and archaeology and history support the bible’s reliability (see Evidence for the Resurrection).
God speaks for himself through the scriptures. Jesus is not a character; he is a living person--very real in the lives of followers today.
If you believe in evolution as given by secular humanists then it is easier to blame God for suffering of the world. If death, disease and suffering came before Satan’s rebellion, then God is to blame. He created a miserable place for us all to fend for ourselves. But that is not what happened. If you believe the bible from Genesis, then you realize that the world was once good. But the perfect world is gone. Death came when Adam brought sin into the world (Ro 5:12, 1 Cor 15:21).
We have an enemy who has been deceiving people for thousands of years. Atheists often have great pride in themselves for being "open-minded" or "not willing to drink the Kool-Aid" but their flattery of themselves is unwarranted (Ro 12:3). You should avail yourself of God's mercy while you can. God's patience is not infinite. The stiff-necked and obstinate man may one day meet with destruction without remedy (Prov 29:1).
Response to Comment: "[The mythology of the bible in no way compares the vastness of the cosmos."
Where did the cosmos come from? Energy cannot create itself. There must be a first cause. The bible calls that first cause a "vibration" Ge 1:2 "The Spirit of God moved (Ge 1:2), which helps explain where everything came from. Any other theory is just that--theory. Anyone can look into the universe and see the greatness of it all (Ps 97:6) but really it is just a backdrop compared to earth.
You may call a Christian a fool but he/she believe that the opposite is true. The bible teaches that it is the atheist who is the fool (Ps 14:1).
Response to Comment: "You keep having to speak for God or refer to the bible to express what plans God has for us."
God makes it clear that he has plans for each of us. For his own, they are good plans (Jer 29:11). For children of wrath, he extends mercy (Eph 2:4).
Response to Comment: "[Y]our fictional God cannot—I repeat, cannot—write or talk in the same way you can. If he is the author of the cosmos, there's no reason at all for an entity of his power to speak scriptures!"
What if he wants to speak through his people? God is unique and able to convey his desires through his saints: "for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit (2 Pe 1:20-21). It is God's universe. He is permitted to communicate in his own way and in his own time. "Are not my ways right...and are not rather your ways perverse?(Ezk 18:29)."
Response to Comment: "If that's the best he can do, well, he has got to be the stupidest God in all of history. I would believe the sun is God before I believe in the fictional character in the bible. It's really that simple for me."
Speaking through his children (because he is gracious by the way) is more wondrous than speaking with an audible voice. Your or I could do that. God is in the still small voice if it is not drowned out.
A created energy ball sustains life and provides warmth.
People were not created to worship it. But your reaction in not uncommon
to man: "Professing to be wise, they became fools, and changed the glory
of the incorruptible God into an image made... (Ro 1:22-23).
Response to Comment: "And I don't need
God's mercy. I only need the companionship of my fellow man and woman. Pure and
simple."
God offers his mercy precisely because we need it. "The Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost [emphasis added] (Lk 19:10)." God made us to need companionship (Eccl 4:9-12). It is his desire to have a relationship with us. Many men would prefer to go to hell than to have a relationship with God.
Response to Comment: And finally, enough
with the scary damnation religious talk. That's also tired and worn out."
"The bloodthirsty hate the blameless, but the upright seek his well-being (Pr. 29:10). The bible has much to say about apathy. It is a form of hatred not to warn your neighbor about his destruction (Pr 27:5).
Response to Comment: "I can sum up why your arguments are weak in a couple sentences...1) Using the Bible as evidence for the Bible is not an effective argument. 2) Threatening us with the wrath of a God we don't believe exists is not an effective argument. You can't scare us into believing...you have to reason us into believing. Show us evidence."
The bible explains itself. Because scripture is inerrant and God-breathed, you can trust it. I agree that a Christian cannot scare another into believing the claims of Christ. Only the Holy Spirit can convince a person to believe. All a Christian can do is plant seeds that you might think about. You need evidence and a softened heart. It is obvious that most of the world stands against Christ. Jesus prophesied this (Mt 7:13).
Response to Comment: "[W]hat's so hard about believing in The Iliad and The Odyssey?
We have better manuscript evidence for the bible. The Iliad and The Odyssey do not make a truth claim. You may dismiss the Bible altogether as if it were any other book, but you reveal your bias against truth.
Response to Comment: "Jesus' resurrection...circular argument."
You don't die for a circular argument. When you understand the importance of independent eyewitness testimony (Jn 5:31) and combine that with a bit of common sense, you have all that you need for faith in Jesus Christ.
Response to Comment: "All four gospels get it just a little different, and to varying degrees of contradiction."
If all four gospels were exactly the same, they would be suspect. Each writer gave his own testimony as to what he witnessed.
Response to Comment: "I've taken my fair share of anthropology and archaeology classes, and I'll tell you right now, the evidence you claim isn't there."
If you want truth, you don't seek it from college professors. See (Archeologist's Spade).
Response to Comment: "I searched high and low before accepting my atheism. I wanted it to be there, but it doesn't exist."
Any genuine search for the Lord should include a turning from sin--or an about face. Anyone who does this will in no wise be cast out (Jn 6:37). You will find truth if you seek it with all of your heart, mind and soul (Mk 12:33). God is not an "it". He is a "he" and you can beg him to save you. Jesus said "I stand at the door and knock," so you will have to open that door.
Response to Comment: "Do you believe The Gilgamesh? Do you believe The Hobbit? Do you believe in UFO's? Is the X-Files fiction or a documentary? Do you believe in the Koran?"
These are works of fiction. The bible is demonstrably true.
Response to Comment: “Iran demonstrates the ultimate result of mixing religion and politics, church and state.”
Ye shall know them by their fruits (Mt 7:16). [Descendants of Ishmael] shall be as a wild ass among men (Ge 16:12).
Response to Comment: "Theocracy is religious fascism!"
Jesus will return to rule and reign. You’d better get ready for that theocracy.
Response to Comment: “[H]uman being [are] wholly irrational creatures [and] we interpret events in our lives.”
It’s called superstition.
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few housekeeping items:
Response to Comment: "I deduct there's a very good possibility this is a copy/paste job...SerpentDove, if you type in your own words, I know I'd answer your points. As it stands, it doesn't look like you're making much effort to engage in a real discussion."
The enclosed link, I copied and scanned from my computer at home.